Hackensack, NJ Community Message Boards
General Category => Hackensack Discussion => Topic started by: BLeafe on May 09, 2011, 11:30:01 PM
-
Hackensack bridge work on schedule
Monday, May 9, 2011
Last updated: Monday May 9, 2011, 6:52 AM
BY CHRIS HARRIS
The Record
STAFF WRITER
HACKENSACK — The rehabilitation of the Court Street Bridge is nearing its halfway point, with work on the century-old swing span expected to continue through the fall, officials said.
"We're pretty much on schedule and on budget," said Bergen County Engineer Robert Mulder, adding that Bergen County hopes to have the bridge open to vehicular traffic by Christmas.
It has been decades since the Court Street Bridge swung into position to allow barges to float up the Hackensack River. But once the rehabilitation is completed, the bridge, which links Hackensack and Bogota, will swing again, Mulder said.
Plans call for an adjoining facility to house the bridge's electronic controls.
The county and the federal government announced plans to rehabilitate the 89-foot-long span last year. All but $2 million of the $19.2 million cost is being financed by President Obama's 2010 stimulus package.
Workers first built a wooden, makeshift bridge on site to support construction cranes. Then they removed the bridge's two trusses and demolished the five support structures — two abutments, two rest piers and the center pivot pier — that held the span in place. Those structures are currently being replaced, Mulder said.
Crews from Hackensack construction company Creamer Sanzari have driven in steel piles to fortify each support and concrete is being poured to create the two new abutments and the three piers.
A motor will be installed on the center pier so the bridge can swing to allow for passing vessels.
Once completed, the bridge will have a new deck of galvanized steel and painted "flint gray" — the color when the bridge opened in 1908.
While the project is on pace for a December opening, Mulder said there's no guarantee the work will be completed by then.
"That's what we're shooting for," he said. "We're not planning on [the project continuing beyond December] but things happen. It is an old structure, after all, and there's some work that is going to be required because of things we didn't foresee."
E-mail: harrisc@northjersey.com
It sounds all well and good, but what's the point of having a swing bridge that accommodates taller watercraft, when there are railroad tracks and the Midtown Bridge just north of it that don't swing open?
Maybe they built it just so The Ling can get out.
Here's a picture I took from behind Pep Boys looking north. Court Street is in the foreground, with the Susquehanna tracks and the Midtown Bridge behind it.
-
An interesting question about why rebuilding it as a swing bridge seems to make sense to someone at a higher level with a bit more info than the common taxpayer.
http://www.northjersey.com/news/96742884_HISTORIC_SWING_BRIDGE_GETTING_FACE-LIFT.html
The article may provide a hint of things to come as far as the Record property and it's future. Possible development as a marina or waterfront condos with a marina would certainly get a big boost by having a swing bridge accessing the rest of the world rather than confining your cruising to a thousand feet on the Hackensack River. Someone is looking ahead and I doubt it has anything to do with the Ling.
-
I happen to have been privy to some of the discussions going on in the County about 5 years ago, when this bridge was in the planning and decision-making process. Their first proposal was to completely eliminate the old bridge and build a new modern bridge much higher above the water. High enough to have allowed pedestrians on the waterfront walkway to pass under it. What stopped that plan was the county's historic community. They lobbied to "keep" the old swinging truss bridge. And the County's decision in the end was to rebuild it in a historic manner, at much higher cost to the taxpayer. They didn't care about the added costs because it was mostly federal grants. Care to know why the federal government is in a budget crisis, it's things like this multiplied a million times all across the country.
It's great that it will help attract upscale development to the vacant Record campus, but the decision had nothing to do with anyone thinking ahead to make that property more attractive to condominiums with a dock for yachts. Don't give our County politicians so much credit for thinking ahead on that one. If it happens to add to the redevelopment potential of The Record, that's just dumb luck.
-
actually, it had to be replaced with either a much higher bridge, which is not possible due to the small amount of room available for approaches, or a swing/draw type of bridge. the river is considered a navagable waterway by the USCG up to the rail bridge and as such must have a bridge to accomodate that. it was ok for it not to open because of disrepair until it had to be replaced. once that happened, it had to be replaced with a bridge that moved
-
An interesting question about why rebuilding it as a swing bridge seems to make sense to someone at a higher level with a bit more info than the common taxpayer.
http://www.northjersey.com/news/96742884_HISTORIC_SWING_BRIDGE_GETTING_FACE-LIFT.html
...I doubt it has anything to do with the Ling.
I read that article last year in a newspaper, so I didn't see the online comments until now. I found #5 interesting.
Of course, the choice of a new swing bridge has nothing to do with the Ling............tongue was planted firmly in cheek, but the bridge WILL be advantageous for the sub because it and the museum were told in 2007 that they would have to leave:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/11/nyregion/nyregionspecial2/11njtopic.html
-
I like Irons explanation. Trying to get the USCG to change the status of that section of the river might have been more trouble than building a swing bridge, especially since the major part of the construction money was Federal. A bonus if the developed Record property includes a marina but a headache for bridge traffic if scheduled openings are frequent.
After all the possibilities are looked at it may be that staying with the status quo for historical reasons is the answer.
-
The County's original plan was to replace the Court Street Bridge with a brand new bridge about 5 or 6 feet higher, and make it a draw bridge. There was never talk about making something very high that large boats can go under, and that doesn't need to be opened (such as the new bridge connecting to the base of Sandy Hook). The Court Street draw-bridge plan was scrapped for the much more expensive historic rendition of a swing bridge. In my humble opinion, a classic example of government waste for no real ends.
As far as history is concerned, it is the USS Ling that should be kept, not some outdated swing bridge technology. It would be a real shame to loose the USS Ling and the Museum. The big question is IF the USS Ling can be moved. It's old, it's rusted, it might not be seaworthy if someone tries to get it towed out of there.
-
I think the Ling must be stuck in the mud. The river hasn't been dredged in decades and I doubt you could tow the sub even if you could get in a large enough vessel. I think there are other bridges in the way also as seen in Bob's picture below.
You'll remember that the Intrepid was stuck in the mud and it took considerable effort to make it budge. If it is ever to be moved, it would probably be by land, in several pieces. This, no doubt, would be a costly proposition.
Related topic: USS Ling to be moved (http://www.hackensacknow.org/index.php/topic,776.msg2253.html#msg2253)
(http://www.hackensacknow.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1925.0;attach=2501;image)
-
Al, that's a view from north of Court St. The Midtown Bridge is behind me and the RR/trolley(?) tracks combo are in the foreground - the reverse angle of the image in my original post - so they would be no impediment to the Ling's potential southerly exit path.
The comments to the article in Hank's link provide the following semi-amusing exchange:
Monday June 21, 2010, 6:37 AM - MiddleMan says:
Even the Ling doesn't need the bridge to swing. It can submerge and pass under it.
Monday June 21, 2010, 12:21 PM - oneseventwo says:
MiddleMan,what will the Ling submerge into? Mud? The Hacky isn't deep enough.
Also, there was a Ling-related letter to the editor in yesterday's Record:
-
I think that our Editor is correct when he says that the Ling must be stuck in the mud. The sub was brought up to Hackensack I believe in 1973 or there about. It got stuck on a mud flat on the way up to it's current location and since the River hasn't been dredged since then I can see a lot of problems moving it downstream .
-
Looking at Google Earth, there are several other bridges to contend with going south although I have no idea about the current clearance height. There are two other railroad lines, both with drawbridges. I wonder about the last time they were opened. Might have been when the Ling was going north.
-
“She still floats,” Mr. Coulson [Naval Museum treasurer] said of the Ling. “We’re sure of that. But the river silted up, so we’ll need to get the Army Corps of Engineers in here to dredge the Hackensack.” - from the previously-posted 2007 NY Times link
"My machine she's a dud, I'm stuck in the mud somewhere in the swamps of Jersey" - from "Rosalita" (Bruce Springsteen)
-
Choice quote. Bruuuuuuceeee! 8)
-
Or to paraphrase Bruce, it sounds like the Ling is a "downbound boat."
If they can't move it, how about converting it to a Starbucks/ Blimpie Base? They could use the galley for food prep and have seating on the deck. Nice site for weddings and repast lunches.
-
how about converting it to a Starbucks/ Blimpie Base?
Homer, the obvious choice would be a SUBway! ;D
Eat fresh!
-
Now, if Ol' Homer's mind is still banging away on all 8 cylinders, didn't the Navy use blimps in WW ll to spot subs off the coast? These blimps would have been stationed in BLIMPie bases .
-
So you want to name the sub's replacement after a sub's nemesis?
If it's ever decided to incorporate something to do with BLIMP into what's there now, maybe they'll let you do the christening on the renamed USS BLING.
-
I will be happy to help christen the new restaurant as long as they have a reception after the ceremony and serve sandwiches on torpedo rolls. The wait staff can serve the sandwiches dressed as navy HEROES.
-
Don't forget dessert!
-
Does anyone remember the short lived yacht/restaurant docked near the courthouse? I was there a few times in the 80's and it was a shaky venture to say the least. Can't recall the name.
Food was edible but mostly a lunch or light menu as I recall. There was a dining room on the main deck and a bar with some tables upstairs. You would need a bigger boat to hold a galley able to prepare exceptional food so diners had to be drawn in by the view of the river and Bogota.
The first time I went there right after it opened they had Rocky Graziano seated at the top of the stairs working as a greeter. It was sad because I remembered him as a great fighter and ten years before would often see him walking around on Manhattan's East side where he lived, always smiling and returning hellos. Sadly by the 80's he was suffering the results of too many head blows and was only able to smile and wave to the folks coming up the stairs. Rocky looked happy and was making a few bucks so life was good in his world.
-
Wow, I forgot all about that place. Went there for lunch 1 or 2 times and the one thing that I remember is that it listed to one side. The food wasn't memorable; but, on those 1 or 2 occassions, I was very happy to return to Terra Firma.
-
Any memory of what the name of the good ship was Homer? About the same time there was a more elaborate vessel docked further South named the Aretusa. 18 bucks for a dozen oysters sticks in my mind.
That was a bigger yacht and the food was decent. A favorite stop on the way to or from the racetrack. Another entry would be The Barge in Carlstadt which now appears to be something else. A good restaurant housed in an old river barge that had a trick moving bar top that made unknowing patrons think they had one too many.
The heyday of the swamp we all love.
-
Another day, another Ling letter in The Record:
-
The job of bridge tender would be tough to fill if there ever was a marina North of the Court St. bridge. It would have to be a scheduled opening on the hour or something like that but I can't imagine where the operator would spend his off 55 minutes between openings. Did they build a tenders hut or a place to serve as a bathroom? Will there be a troll under the bridge?
It could be considered a political plum or a sentence in hell depending on it's use.
As to the reason for the swing bridge, as Irons stated it is considered navigable water...look up the definition of navigable waterways and find it is firmly embedded in the Federal domain with D.C. deciding what is or is not a navigable waterway. The last thing I would want to do is to try to change the Federal mind on something as complex and far reaching as this, charts and all that stuff....lets just build a swing bridge and spend some money and make some jobs and everyone is happy.
-
A current post about George Stimmel prompted a search on this site for Stimmel images.
After going here - http://www.hackensacknow.org/index.php/topic,1028 - I came across the below image about which the Editor said, "My guess is that it is the Court Street Bridge under construction."
Whether it is or isn't, it kinda reminds me of a Court St Bridge shot I took last week (second image).
-
Very apropos. I wonder if anyone will paint the new span. If not, I'm sure we can count on a few good photos.
-
Some numbers on the Ling:
Draft (amount of depth needed to sail): 16'10". Source: http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ships/SS/SS-297_Ling.html
The current Hackensack River channel is 32 feet deep for the first 3 miles, 25 feet deep for the next ¼ mile, and 15 feet deep for an additional ½ mile. (Going south to north) Source: http://urbanhabitats.org/v02n01/3centuries_full.html
Assuming the above is correct, several miles would have to be dredged by almost two feet unless there was some way to reduce the draft, perhaps by removing some weight.
-
From The Record, Monday, May 16:
-
That boat isnt going anywhere, at least by water. it is so stuck in the silt the only way it is moving is by a cutting torch. nobody is going to spend the hundreds of thousands of dollars needed to dredge around it, and then, hope it doesnt split in two at the bottom when its moved. a balao class sub does not have a very thick skin around its skeleton.
-
Prior to Tilcon & Raia...it was the Geo M. Brewster Ashphalt Plant..I back my Grand Fathers dump trucks under their Hopper many times.
-
I haven't been to the site in a few months, so I figured that the crane must have placed the brand-new bridge in place by now.
Not only hasn't that happened, but the old bridge is STILL intact and sitting there off to the side!
What I saw basically was two ends of a road being built toward each other (see first photo - click to enlarge). I asked a worker when they might be done.
"Next year"
Would the new bridge be a flat road with no steel structure?
"No. The old bridge will be placed on the road."
Is that common knowledge? I hadn't heard it before. 1908 sitting on 2012 sounds like an interesting sight.
Apparently, the steel of the old bridge is being reworked/replaced, but it will look the same (second picture).
You know those people who wait for days to be the first to cross a bridge when it opens? A fancy convertible with a Mickey Mouse hood ornament is already lined up to be #1 (third picture).
.
-
Would the new bridge be a flat road with no steel structure?
"No. The old bridge will be placed on the road."
Is that common knowledge? I hadn't heard it before. 1908 sitting on 2012 sounds like an interesting sight.
Well, 1908 is now sitting on 2012 and it's a visual zero.
-
From the Bogota side:
Meet the new bridge
(almost the) Same as the old bridge
-
Kelly: The bridge that may never swing
Sunday August 12, 2012, 5:30 AM
By MIKE KELLY
RECORD COLUMNIST
SOMETIME in the coming weeks, a new bridge will open across the Hackensack River. This is supposed to be a remarkable achievement. Really?
We are accustomed to think of public works projects as positive steps. When potholes get filled, we usually smile. The same is generally true when fresh grass is planted in a worn out park or when broken curbs and sidewalks are given a facelift and new lights are installed on a dark patch of road.
The same can’t be said of the soon-to-open Court Street Bridge in Hackensack.
Before you read further, you need to know that this is not just an ordinary bridge. Nor is it an ordinary public works project. This bridge repair was a decision by political figures who were told they had to spend money on “shovel ready” projects.
So they made a choice – the Court Street Bridge. For $19.2 million dollars, otherwise unemployed construction crews would have something to do. And the residents of Central Bergen County would have a refurbished bridge spanning the Hackensack River.
So far, so good, right?
A month after taking office in January 2009, President Obama signed the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act, the economic stimulus package. The idea was to pump federal dollars into construction projects and possibly jump start the sluggish economy and relieve the 17 percent unemployment in America’s construction trades.
New Jersey had choices to make, however. Most of the state’s bridges needed work. But bridges were just the tip of the construction iceberg. From roads to schools, the Garden State had plenty of places to spend the stimulus dollars.
How did it happen?
So how did the leaders of our state chose to spend almost $20 million on a two-lane bridge in Hackensack that was carrying only about half the vehicles each day in 2009 that it carried in 1980?
That question takes on even greater importance when you consider that only $26 million in federal stimulus aid had been earmarked for infrastructure repairs in Bergen County. So think of the Court Street Bridge as the big shark that gobbled up all the fish and left only a few minnows behind.
But the question of whether one project might suck away an unfair amount of stimulus cash did not seem to be an issue in 2009. The key factor was timing and a deadline for receiving the cash.
When the Obama administration gave America its economic stimulus plan, there was a catch. In order to receive money, states had to identify “shovel-ready” projects in which work could begin within 90 days. Believe it or not, the Court Street Bridge was one of the few local projects with plans already drawn up and a price tag that fell below the $26 million in infrastructure funds that were targeted for Bergen County.
So under the guidance of then-County Executive Dennis McNerney and the board of freeholders, the Court Street Bridge contract was signed. The bridge was closed for its repairs in June 2010. The work was supposed to be finished by Christmas 2011.
That deadline came and went – with the bridge not fixed. As of last week, construction crews were still hard at work. And if they finish by September – as they are promising to do – it will mean that 27 months were needed to fix a bridge that is only 89 feet long.
Efficiency?
This story gets worse.
For some bizarre reason the old Court Street Bridge, built in 1908, was considered a historic landmark – one of the oldest truss spans in New Jersey. It seems that the state Historic Preservation Office mandated that the county re-use pieces of the old bridge.
A needless demand
But when you consider that much of the old bridge was worn out and rusted, this might seem like an odd and needless demand. As a result, workers embarked in a time-consuming process of dismantling the bridge piece-by-piece without breaking any of the rusty historic pieces.
Now at this point, you might be asking: Why do we want to save an old, rusty bridge? Good question. It’s not as if George Washington marched over it.
But this is the kind of bureaucratic rule that were imposed on what should have been a simple bridge repair job.
Incredibly, the rules get worse.
The federal government designated the Hackensack River as a commercial waterway. For the bridge, this meant that it had to be designed to swing open to allow boats to pass by.
But there was a not-so-small problem.
The Hackensack River is so filled with silt that only small boats can navigate the part of the river near the Court Street Bridge. It’s been more than 15 years since the last barge floated by and the old truss bridge had to be opened.
So here is the final scorecard: North Jersey will soon have a new bridge that can swing open for large boats and barges. But no large boats can get near the bridge because the river is too clogged with mud and silt.
This is what is known as a stimulus package.
Mike Kelly is a Record columnist. Contact him at kellym@northjersey.com.